brokos

你们居然...

二战小子

貌似阻止日酋下南洋的想法是基于可以四发对海只是限制高度等一些摘自官网上极端有利米帝的HR做出的说 。

hades1001

This is the HR I was talking about.( o7 `, o# p( {: n$ m: k7 v$ z
0 t; ?& r& Y/ e' F1 x- A
' N, T9 H# W& c  K: `: z
2 G- z1 I- m7 }! ^+ c* f
Sub control on,  yes1 A" K" w: l' S6 G- N" }9 B
& z: X0 q& K2 E, {" |0 ~
: U  @$ T3 q$ ?3 d' V" ^) S
: z9 \0 I) e/ w5 p
possibility for Jap to convert Research industry to production, yes* b* S* T9 M% \. @' g9 z

5 C+ y* n4 ~9 W9 z: s) r, E* P2 z+ H2 U' e9 {4 Q# a9 K
& ?5 G$ W: _' \; ]. b
1st turn surprise, with ally that can move only
* ?' D6 t( f: y/ X* E+ Lfleet at sea and jap that can only make 1 port attack.... , yes4 l0 p3 z( G$ t5 A1 Y3 v
* d! A; x* h( Z* n# t( O
8 O9 r7 o4 s9 P: d6 }# ?
1 k* R; g7 o9 w+ I( e
we have to decide if it's allowed to invade in any hex  or only where there ! U, M; i4 A: }' Q
is a port, either way is ok by me+ d$ @9 F, d* _1 |

. d$ b6 W, ~6 q! W3 M0 H; c* I
9 G# o- [- U  X# t
6 e! T" o# ^, z0 Y  ~- r! w# z" A2 Cpara can be dropped in small portion, no/ |1 J/ {" u7 h! J. f- O1 w( `3 C
, q- b! j$ Q0 X+ M- ~5 z. h4 y4 q
# C' C8 \4 j" W% K) ~* o+ p# T" r
& T2 {5 j& T" `0 K& j
if it's allowed small invsion from subs, no
! U, S& l, s( s( I( c* Q" d. x: z' D9 M
$ w+ W9 Z7 {8 z3 Y$ F" T/ e: v
) K/ l, a7 D' o+ Q7 r$ Q4 S
Somebody use restriction in the number of AntiSub fleet, no restriction on both side
* u5 F$ a% a0 U# x" H
9 M2 g3 M) ~0 u2 \& @* T: M3 b1 u7 v7 I7 T' ?3 D, H

8 Q% L' b, M$ D7 m# s8 O. Lin use of 4E bomber, 20000ft for any mission.- [. r, b9 ~. y: v) q
$ U4 U7 ]- h7 _, B8 K+ P
& J/ T+ X/ q1 g9 O  I! z5 o
0 S/ _% i4 g, C/ E
HRs
& U& J# K2 m% u# z9 Z$ u
5 K- S5 \: j7 YDay 1 ; _2 @) n1 V$ |" f
- T9 D1 a5 O7 `6 Q2 Z9 c% ^' F1 |
1. No attack on CV. & b( V9 ~' Y# l  R: I

0 u/ M  F/ U* J  E7 B- L2. Only 1 port attack.
' M1 L% o0 u4 o1 k0 x3 _/ t8 \+ \% [' Z: _4 t- n* T
3. Only realistic movement on day one (no PM, Pago Pago or Amboina or java landings). , ]8 w3 F0 N, C* V; i

& C' c) @( d. |: |6 z4. Allied player can only move fleet on the sea.
" n3 U. M  H5 g/ C
) ~1 ?2 R& @$ L5 r, [1 ~1 L- S* T4 O$ t1 Q
/ W  c5 m, O" j) |% ~% V0 D6 _8 C
Commen HRs
* b/ `# ^& B# }; G/ B! x: y$ W* R) u6 r: A- K! G
1. Russia must warned one week before invasion (i.e. declare war and wait one week).
/ B. m3 m& y/ g1 x6 ^6 ?5 ]! Z$ v. ~; t9 M/ R  m: f) \' E; B
6. If Burma road is cut by Jap unit(s), all Chinese units out of china must be set as No replacements. ; }" }7 g4 g" G9 j& {7 F
" u9 m- v2 H1 l/ G. F7 S' c
7. No mining from planes
- m" g8 ~6 r6 b% H; {3 o1 y2 L" h* d: {# |& K8 ~8 D  Q
11. No sub commandos.
0 M; k) _% K6 x& a2 `- O0 ?- F& d# i$ |2 l
12.Paras can attack only as whole unit. ; B) R8 a- t% b. }/ C. A% V; p

7 j0 @* t2 K, e" b, |# V5 V/ b' [16.The shift of units using HQ change is banned.
( }) o( W: M2 s3 K; h' M. X5 c* d2 H) g- _- C
17.Units in Mandzukuo must have at least 8000AS.
3 d0 D3 Z% y0 W* H! [, P3 }) v  T+ U0 E% l
18.Jap units in China could be used only there, if china is not occupied. The same for Chinese units (Indochina is considered as China).
( Z# H. @+ `6 h8 J3 K2 M: u
  q2 t1 _  D6 n# I19.Chinese troops under SEA command can be used only in Burma. : q# o# q' F- w% S

; X# b9 Z! ~& e+ z20.4E minimum naval attack altitude is 20000 9 w7 I+ s1 P. b& L# m
# P$ f# ~: p$ z1 u, d& T, b
21.No upgrade 2E to 4E with exception of Bolo planes. ' `2 o& u5 t$ K: w: L9 Z& B* ]8 b

) y0 I/ }& O* U: Q22.4E can attack from China from July 1944; no city attack on chinese towns.
- i3 M8 U6 F, K0 |* C/ X2 V  j! m! s. h9 h' M8 x" o
23.No 4E naval attacks after 1942.
& w/ _5 _2 A4 N  s' i
" y( U/ g. \$ k6 i8 A25.Max number of planes is 50xAF size! C0 L! }, i$ j7 b
' |: }" Q5 G. f: R8 Y2 Z- S  V8 d& D
26.No PT is allowed in the game, except the existing at the beginning of the war.
2 O) u6 k: B! u3 i8 |; a! M- w# A
0 c7 z3 p* {7 l2 x% Q3 E9 V3 g1 R
5 a: G- H! `/ p( H/ r! d28. No single ship TF in both friend or enemy base/dots, just pass the base/dot doesn't count. $ @" `  E  a) \2 b( D$ Q) [2 x
At least 5 ships in one TF when in friendly base, if there is less than 5 ships in one base, keep them together, disbanding your ships into port is not restricted.
% M- F! O$ f) C' }4 A8 P) q. Q( E4 uThe number of transport TFs for invasion should be minimized.e.g., If you 150 transports for an invasion mission, there should be only 2 transport TF landing.
+ S) s4 w9 V  R3 c# Z, U
- e9 f3 j/ X& W5 M% h29. No land combats in North Pacific, including Alaska, Aleutian islands, north of Hokkaido, and kamchatka.
: S/ Q: v$ m! E
" b. d9 c6 L$ p  @& B9 c) P30. No city attacks on asian continents.
# W6 X/ u9 |1 k* e; L* Q8 @% h" a# b4 L4 D( ]3 ]! [: T
31. Only air groups designed by game can run night air attacks. 7 E" Y- v  D7 u3 c: h
7 c# b# j- Q3 s+ t1 Z. t
32. No US marine Cosairs on carrier before Jan 1st, 1945, when using carriers transport cosairs, the mission of cosair should be set on"stay down". No britain cosairs on US carriers. Only F4U-1D on carriers.
" u* s: w* D. L6 F, n  O% x+ u# A3 z8 D
33. No shinden, shiden and raiden on Japan carriers. $ x' X4 S9 v$ U0 ~3 |9 \
9 M) Q9 \8 t+ c2 [3 e" k
34. No allies aircrafts can use Russia bases. - ?# B9 |! N' A4 }( B0 l9 |% o
9 P; [' T( W. {
35. The total number of aircrafts for CV tf is limited to 600 per hex before Jan. 1st, 1944, after is 800. Number of CV is not restricted. 5 I4 H, n" N8 l% o7 H( D6 Z+ G$ t
3 k/ `. Q$ F: v/ D, Y* O
36. No unrealistic para attack to stop enemy from retreating and armor units pursuing ememy.
/ Q3 w, z: M" U+ L% f2 Y# c
( h0 A, v1 X9 Z6 e2 e( t37. No small units entering enemy units hex to stop them from moving. Recon purpose mission can only be executed once.

111555111

4E minimum naval attack altitude is 20000
) t% F3 M) c% j1 a7 XNo 4E naval attacks after 1942.
% P$ ]  W; x2 }: n4 Y7 I, y) ]居然允许4E对海？难道说老外有办法对付后期茫茫多的4e?即使42年也足够KB喝一壶的了

championzhao

另一个版本的房规, o# l/ K! a0 t3 F
( j9 C7 }" f- e7 V
General House Rules: 8 B4 v) h# \- J, _4 [9 b
1. No rearming TFs in ports smaller than 3 without an AE present
% d0 r$ I/ v: T( H2. No refueling of capital ships in ports smaller than 3 without an AO or TK present (Capital ships are  cruisers and larger)
+ U" o7 W; b5 Z1 b- ~4 q; y5 s3. PT Boats may not be included in TFs with other ships (exception: Rule #5) $ A/ e8 q5 R& l( X8 Y
4. PT Boat TF may have a max of 6 ships in it
4 Y6 L; L- f8 t  y% B# M" Q+ g! g" A5. PT Boat TF may only have other ships in it - or more than 6 - when transferring between bases - using the  extra ships as portable fuel sources
, c% h8 v1 `9 @0 i5 Y! f5 j, |6. No creating Barges / PT Boats at bases smaller than 3 or that are behind enemy lines - cut off. It is  unrealistic to have new PT boats magically appear at bases behind enemy lines without having to sail there and  be subjected to enemy attack 7 h$ u# o0 }3 M. x8 @
7a. No paradropping behind enemy lines to cut off line of retreat (by method of creating a contested hex) just  for the purpose of forcing unit surrender. I.e. 150 paratroopers can't force the surrender of 50,000 infantry  units in retreat. Using paratroopers to capture undefended base, even if in line of retreating unit is however  perfectly acceptable. 7 e/ }3 r8 O" P; }
7b. No use of construction units/base forces to create ZOC's to cut retreat paths (I had an PBEM opponent who  did this).
' w$ r7 m8 w6 F  C& i7c. No landings in non-base/dot hexes to cut off enemy forces (there is a hex in the PI that invites to do  just this, (because Japanese forces never retreat and guns do not fire on TF's landing troops in non-base/dot  hexes it is impossible to defend this hexes even if one guards them with overhelming forces, basically a cheap  way for the Japanese to cut certain retreat paths)
6 Y# n% k4 ^& J- n$ c8 P8 y8 Z8. No 2+ engine bomber missions (against either land or naval targets) above 25000 feet – requirement for Nik  mod
& f1 [( j) M8 Z+ x( a9. No 2+ engine bombers performing night bombing (only naval and city attacks allowed at night). ! X' P: u8 H+ D) J, h
10. As the weather is supposed to be clear in the whole map, any major airstrike cancelled at turn 1 will  trigger a redo turn.
7 W$ l8 n8 M1 |' B$ e- d& x11. Aircraft transitioning between major types (DB->LB, etc) require a "in training" and refitting period of 2  months prior to deployment. (Does not affect same type transitions) " p  @, \4 O1 `0 b  [
Turn 1: . k5 E8 N0 s3 x/ |2 q: @; t1 s
12. KB is allowed to raid Manila, PH, or Singapore on turn one. 5 Z5 W% T, G! A$ T& j1 O
13. Allied player may give any orders to already existing US TFs at sea, the China Command units, and all  British/Dutch/Australian/New Zealand units on turn one including air units. Allies can also give any  construction or HQ change orders he desires to any of his bases on turn one.
0 ?* p( G4 O( U7 P& I( z# F0 F6 @2 \14. The Japanese may not sail past Singapore to the north on turn 1 (no landing at Johore to cut Singapore off  from the rest of Malaya on turn 1) – going to leave this one in. I can hardly imagine the Brits in Singapore  allowing a huge IJN transport fleets to sail pass their port unharrassed.
" k$ i* j' _6 ^" j- S8 k15. Japanese can only make turn one landings at allied bases that are within 15 hexes of a Japanese base -  Exception: the Japanese may always invade Wake on turn one. # F7 J& w8 e* S5 m, U" l

2 Y- m! T3 V7 x0 X  [, YIJN Player:
% h  r  `8 X$ h9 t/ j# x16. No units of the Kwangtung HQ may be moved out of the area without first paying the applicable PP costs  (Land or Air units) ' Z3 @' o! X- s" a- i
17. Float planes other than Glens not allowed on subs
' [0 ^7 G5 v6 |2 q; P8 g$ X18. Kwantung units can be moved to China only paying PPs * F, H" G* a$ R) U2 S, |3 @5 o
Allied Player: . @; S0 `& b# B% m5 @$ {
23. The allies cannot simply pick up and withdraw from Malaya, PI, or the DEI without putting up significant  fights. This will stop the allied player from playing on hindsight and evacuating all of the Dutch forces  before they are even attacked - very unrealistic. % r; \3 u7 {0 @; w1 g
24. No Allied CV Capable air units on CVs until 1/44 - designed to keep Marine Fighter groups off CVs
/ C! `6 w) z9 H+ z" Y; i# a6 ]3 a25. The 1st & 2nd USMC Divisions cannot move beyond the Hawaiian islands (or west coast) until April 1st,  1942. This is to simulate when the 1st Div becomes operational and the major concern for the defense of the  Hawaiian Islands and west coast. 0 K5 s- G3 A3 Z  H
26. Allied player may not "overly" strip India and southern oz of all troops. & @4 ~" M6 e' q* e) s8 ?
27. Allied level bombers may only fly once every 2 days.
' M# a  c8 {! {4 m, O( P28. No Allied Heavy Bombers stationed in china – no 4 engine bombers may conduct Bombing raids from Chinese  bases – this to reflect the lack of fuel and supplies the Chinese had to use such planes.
) c6 ~% y! f  v, F. b8 n29. Allied bomber units may upgrade to any 4 engine bomber, if those units either are or divide into 12  aircraft groups. The 16 aircraft allied bomber groups may only upgrade to a 2 engine bomber at the most. , w7 V9 r1 {2 a# W" S
30. No Allied skip bombing (100 ft. altitude naval attacks with level bombers) until 1/1/1943

chars

6. If Burma road is cut by Jap unit(s), all Chinese units out of china must be set as No replacements
1 c9 o) ~0 `# w  c
) c$ G- I5 i7 A& v19.Chinese troops under SEA command can be used only in Burma
6 l9 I3 ~# M& d  s, a  I1 T: K- C
' s/ y3 h: P! N! {0 g这两条比较有意思

bio

有点道理

我是大鲨鱼

没道理啊
* f3 @. P4 ^; J
; q: }+ c0 O0 q4 n  q) {& r首先，要知道相当多的国军可能都已经在旧金山投胎了，不能让他们饿死在罐头堆里嘛……
9 K/ w) f9 _) M" |/ M, g1 G( j0 p
0 |2 }4 N7 Q" C: U3 M  m8 X/ J其次，远征军入印貌似是合理选择，只是老蒋太贪权才逼他们走野人山……

我是大鲨鱼

形势比人强，2月26日阿奎回信鸟
, i# x+ i5 q" B) y! y
7 x# G$ Q+ t( a4 f2 Baqui just sent you a private message at 2/25/2009 5:39:15 PM:
3 ^) O5 s2 |) K3 K; I
5 X7 c: J; x6 @" L; S3 P~~~~~~~~~~~~~~% \5 b+ Z5 b" r" f
HOUSE RULES
/ r+ n9 x+ X/ s8 U~~~~~~~~~~~~~~! G# l7 f- y: S& G/ x

% @) P: E( K0 v5 s7 `; X; xI have many perplexities about these house rules; in my opinion the most part of them is a useless burden and another part has the effect to choke strategical choices in the name of a assumed more historical behaviour. Luckily, as now, nobody suggested that all Jap TF compositions and obiectives are to be known by Ally because Ally decrypted jap codes. Any case, here my point of view:) [! I8 b* g: g' w2 ~
1) OK!) ^! D& f& }+ G* x* O
7) OK (but wih some perplexity)
& g. ?0 _& J5 \. X* Q8) "No mining for planes"... bad HR. During the war, both sides mined port with planes. I can accept this rule but disagree.7 t1 c. W2 c8 G# S6 L
11) ok
8 k, o3 {# @- ~0 |$ F12) ok
4 X; T$ D( Q' e) q+ D7 z2 c16) if I understand correctly...it's allowed to change units attachement but not HQ attachment. Is it so?9 _- [8 w  B) |& v- }
In case I can accept it% ~& s$ T! O/ s, {. c2 Z# y
17) according to the game rules if Jap goes down 8000 garrison there is a small prob that Russian attack Jap. I prefer rather  the original rule than the HR. This HR worsen the game  but, any case I can accept (but disagree).6 }/ o; X5 U8 y; f7 d. `
18) I suppose that for "occuped" you mean "fully occuped" (till the last city). This HR sound me bad. If, for example, Jap has taken all China cities except 1, he has to keep there million of men to kill last chinese soldat? But a part from this.... if for some  strategical reason Jap decide to concentrate his effort in another sector giving up China, he cannot do this? There are already garrison rule in the game that force Jap to leave a lot of units if they want to control cities. This HR impoverish the game. Again... I can accept but disagree
% U+ N0 o$ O0 i: S; z% e19)20)21)22)23)24)25)26) no enthusiasm but ok to all.7 H- m7 v- H. ~* ]1 a
28) this rule can cause problems worse than the problem it tries to solve. 1° example. In a Air combat fleet (with 3 CVs and 3 DD) 1 CV becomes damaged. To allow docking in an empty port you have to escort it  with at least 4 ships. In short, you have to give up the operation. <absurd! Or, 2° example: after a port attack the same fleet as before remains with only 3 surviving ships (3CV); because it has not the legal number to sail they have to wait to be all sunk...and so on. as written this is not an acceptable rule. The 2nd part of the rule could be OK.
+ S: K& J& L5 H9 f( X# y29) Aleutinian for example were attacked from Jap (that landed there during Midway operation). Again a rule limiting the stategic options. What the meaning?
  ?* \, z: s- v. B30)31)32)33)34)35) Ok (but....)6 f* y7 k. v4 i1 ]8 |1 g
36) to cut the retreat is one of the main task of parà troops and eventually armor pursuit (a bazooka can easily destroy the "biggest" Jap tank). I don't like this rule, also unhistorical
$ O5 k( t7 w7 ]7 a/ m3 N37) I understand the meaning of this rule but what is "small unit"? Isn't it right (for example) that a small but competent units (like a 20 Assault infantry) can  sacrifice itsself to stop the enemy?
3 w3 t9 c. c$ H2 UYour HR don't speak about some point like: the possibility to surround enemy force with small units like AA, ART, ecc to avoid enemy retreat..or the possibility to transfer in 1 day lot of planes by land also where there is no trail connecting the bases  (or when the airbase and the planes are damaged..).
1 e- W+ B0 j' b, ?cya3 A" {: A1 W- w( K, I- b5 L
paolo9 P' B7 r6 A% i* z$ i

; P4 c$ {2 D! g; Q" b# f- ]2 j
. x! o) k* _, J1 x. ~' r! ^& q随后这位可爱的面条国亲善使者发现自己还忘了几句话，于是连续补了两封邮件，内容如下：0 _( B) w" r, V4 n# u/ J

  C: Q' \3 z/ }  }$ n  r7 [# eaqui just sent you a private message at 2/25/2009 5:45:49 PM:1 |# ~% m7 v( T6 X

/ p" P( \* }. K! U% k' R~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
  t' D. g% c- ?, H( a7 |/ D% y WITP experienced player
1 ^5 m9 q! b& M8 E- H~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
* q- F1 t# e4 s) E1 g# F- @0 s, [! q* g: u# _5 \$ U7 F' l" x
I forgot...* R6 y5 S! n  _. x2 J6 Q7 F# N
about "Only realistic movement on day one (no PM, Pago Pago or Amboina or java landings)": are Borneo and Sumatra regarded as "realistic" obiectives?
* |3 V5 v0 D6 h: x: X) G) V, L) icya
: H/ R; u8 U1 W5 o$ k3 E  a8 `$ XPaolo5 }* f: W3 G: J  }: V( T

% S5 b& s, b  s& Q' R/ ~----------- End of Private Message (PM) -------------
) i- x8 m4 F" U. P/ g2 s. d$ v7 M2 O

% i6 i% v7 l  B2 b, E% n9 t5 Baqui just sent you a private message at 2/26/2009 7:05:45 AM:/ F# y! j* u: ^$ R- k9 A

6 l/ n' ?$ D+ L% u9 n% K# E~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
6 }# m0 c" T" r7 P$ d7 A0 o  s RE: WITP experienced player
- q: k* J) o& o3 \1 Y6 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+ ]* T  f2 l) z; _
, w' ^. Z: E, H# q2 [$ o
I sent you an e-mail that probably you didn't receive (but when we start to use normal e-mail instead of this PM system??) where I explained why I didn't like "common rules" 7, 17, 18, 19, 28, 29, 36, and 37. Specificaly House Rule 28 looks very dangerous.
* l6 f, \6 `' s1 T- Gdid you receive that e-mail?
5 E) E* ~" i$ Q1 ]) L1 Rcya, \$ w0 m- |, \1 r# H0 m+ {0 a
paolo
  O/ i0 Y3 S/ I) A
2 x7 Y" d5 G& O9 f  R3 w" t5 {8 w' T----------- End of Private Message (PM) -------------
( j5 G; n; w# G. ~, `' i* Y; k* `8 q: Z7 J; b

. @+ z' s. k0 M# Q3 y# w有请鸟语达人共入翻译之

111555111

28) this rule can cause problems worse than the problem it tries to solve. 1° example. In a Air combat fleet (with 3 CVs and 3 DD) 1 CV becomes damaged. To allow docking in an empty port you have to escort it  with at least 4 ships. In short, you have to give up the operation. <absurd! Or, 2° example: after a port attack the same fleet as before remains with only 3 surviving ships (3CV); because it has not the legal number to sail they have to wait to be all sunk...and so on. as written this is not an acceptable rule. The 2nd part of the rule could be OK9 i8 A+ s# w7 x3 Y& z' w

) s' B7 p( I( j' y鬼佬主要是在不满28条 我觉得他没理解这规定的含义。。。3 |! w* N! ^- j; s9 P, m6 M
2 M7 X5 Y, M* S% ^+ r
译：这条规定可能导致的问题比它解决的问题还严重，例如一个空战舰队（3CV3DD）一艘CV受创，为了让她入港需要3艘DD跟随，简而言之，你不得不抛弃护航<荒谬 例2 上诉同一舰队在一次对港袭击后只剩下三艘CV，因为没有达到规定的数量，他们只能原地等死。。。因此这条房规不能接受，不过第二部分说不定还ok.

111555111

37) I understand the meaning of this rule but what is "small unit"? Isn't it right (for example) that a small but competent units (like a 20 Assault infantry) can  sacrifice itsself to stop the enemy?
2 M' \! j/ O( D8 {% ]( w6 dYour HR don't speak about some point like: the possibility to surround enemy force with small units like AA, ART, ecc to avoid enemy retreat..or the possibility to transfer in 1 day lot of planes by land also where there is no trail connecting the bases  (or when the airbase and the planes are damaged..).; J( q2 V2 H$ y1 D0 \7 O  X
# D- C' h( n' e; A
我明白这条房规的用意，但小单位的定义是？是不是一股小部队但又能胜任牺牲自己堵住敌人退路的任务（像一只有20战斗力的步兵）。还有你的房规没有提到像用AA.ART等单位堵路，或者一天之内在没有铁路链接的基地间转移很多飞机（或者当机场的飞机已经损坏）

111555111

29) Aleutinian for example were attacked from Jap (that landed there during Midway operation). Again a rule limiting the stategic options. What the meaning?! m9 C7 r! f5 Q7 f" x
7 F7 x/ U" }6 R! G& R! P7 m
译：在历史上日本在中途岛行动的同时曾攻击过阿留申群岛。又一个限制战术选择的规定，什么意思？
( t, a5 N4 {9 i9 U/ G0 U, k; F! Y. L) I$ i8 [7 O8 g  G2 B9 j

2 O! A# ~8 p0 y) L4 ]2 O我靠！感情这鬼佬想玩无限制战啊。。。好啊，通通答应他，然后打得他像当年被小哈虐的那个捷克老一样哭着喊着要TJ

阿姆罗

意大利的帕瓦罗蒂诞生了 我认为不用屎大出马，也许歌手就能让Y的歇菜